The Borough Council has now decided not to sell off Rowley's House after a council vote.

http://www.shropshirestar.co.uk/2006/12/co...museum-building

The museum is still moving out of Rowley's House though - to the Music Hall - and so we will now end up with an empty building and a lost development opportunity for Barker Street car park.

This town sure does know how to waste time and more time. :angry:

http://www.shrewsbury.gov.uk/public/news/c...djacentsite.htm

So what's going to happen next? What will the car park site and the Rowley's House & Mansion be used for?

I have a funny feeling this won't be dealt with anytime soon. Well, not with the borough council in charge of Shrewsbury. Roll on the Shropshire unitary authority and a Shrewsbury Town Council!

I really haven't been paying attention recently, so I'd appreciate your thoughts.

I am of course vaguely aware that there are proposals to make Shropshire a unitary authority, along the lines of Herefordshire, but beyond listening to someone grumbling at work about how he suspected that this would mean that council tax levels in North Shrophire district will rise to meet those of SABC (I could only nod and grit my teeth), I have absolutely no idea of the pros and cons of the whole thing.

I presume it will save someone some money, as it will cut out some duplication between district and county (OK, I realise that district and county have different functions, but there will be some overlap among admin staff at least).

What's going on?

To put it simply, the County Council will be requesting the government soon for the abolition of the district/borough councils in Shropshire, thus making the county a unitary area with the County Council as its unitary authority. It doesn't affect Telford and Wrekin. Shrewsbury would then need to be parished and a Town Council would be set up.

Power to the people! :lol: A petiton is a petition and consensus showed.

If the council botches again probably time to let someone else take the helm !

Hang on, hang on... I'm never too sure about petitions. All it shows is that a couple of determined people managed to get some other people's signitures. If there was a vote (a borough wide referendum) I wonder how the results would look. I suggest that there are a lot of people out there who, like myself, agree that we should move on and sell off and develop that part of town.

one woman got over 8,000 people to sign that petition.

that means that 8,000 people cared enough to take the time to stop and write their name,address and postcode.

full credit to Ms Owen for the hours she has put in sat outside shopping centres and supermarkets etc

if you care so much about developing Rowleys,start a petition of your own and see how many people take the time to sign.

this was about neither standing still nor moving on but the people of Shrewsbury wishing to retain public access to one of the oldest warehouses in the country.

s.g.d.

I see your point David. I think we've had this debate before.

If the consultation process was more publicised on the offset regarding this issue I feel the public would not be so 'up in arms'. This council makes decisions, then backpedals. It's all down to consultation

Okay, fine.

So what happens now? What is Rowley's House and Mansion going to be used for? Will Barker Street car park and other car parks in that area be developed?

I only am slightly peeved because it seems that once again an opportunity for Shrewsbury has been lost because of a lack of proper decision making and fear of change/the unknown from the public.

Is it any wonder that Shrewsbury is becoming an unheard of "out in the sticks" "good for nothing" kind of place with low wage jobs and young, talented people moving away?!

I think that we will have to agree to differ on your view of Shrewsbury.

s.g.d.

I'm not the only one with that view. Ask anyone outside Shropshire about Shrewsbury and yes they will say "beautiful town, historic buildings, good for shopping, etc etc" but there is a feeling that there's not much else. And sadly I think they're right. Employment is very limited in the town and in Shropshire in general and is mostly low paid jobs. The biggest employers in Shrewsbury are the County Council, Borough Council and the NHS. A lot of wealth creation there... not.

it depends on what is important to the individual - money or quality of life?

yes, people can leave Shrewsbury, for more money, but a lot choose not to.

s.g.d.

Famous sayings about Shrewsbury:

Standing Stillsbury!

Shrewsbury, graveyard of ambition!

Never heard of it is it in Wales?

Who needs a Uni when we've got Squaddies? Opps, we haven't even got them now!

Shrewsbury in Gloom :(

I was asked to sign that petition, and chose not to as I could see that Rowleys House , lovely though it is is not suitable for a museum and does not have impaired mobility access. I'm not entirely sure that the Music Hall is a better choice however.

Ms Owen should have asked for proof of place of birth before collecting her signatures as only those 'born and bred' in Shrewsbury can contribute to sewing the Corbet bedhangings apparently.



BTW Proud Salopian have you been to see Borat at the cinema yet? It is not one to miss!!!!

Graveyard of ambition - well of course it is, once you're here, why ever would you want to move? The rest of the world is a disappointment after Shrewsbury.

There's no doubt there's a brain drain in Shrewsbury, much as there is in places like NZ or Australia, all the ambitious people in their mid 20s leave.
Those people who have 'saved' Rowleys House will now wait at least three years before anything is decided for it.
If a developer had come in I'm sure more people would have used it, it would have been perfect for a cafe area.
So what if we couldn't go upstairs because there were offices up there, and so what if flats were on the car park. It would have brightened up the area, given the church a make over, the bus stop area a new lease of life, and possibly revamped thopse horrendous toilets.
Now it will be closed, remain empty, no1 will be able to get in, and we have no idea what will happen in three years time.
Innovations like the Old Market Hall are what makes Shrewsbury special today. Rowleys Houses does not - but it could have been.

Money v. Quality of life

Shrewsbury offers a great environment in which to live, work and shop... no doubt about it. Shropshire on the whole - even Telford - is a lovely county. Growing up here has been great. Retiring here - also great. Living here with a well paid job in a nearby connurbation such as the West Midlands or Manchester - good going too. But for people in their 20s and 30s who want to have good job opportunities and become prosperous it's attrocious.

Standing Stillbury

Yes, I heard this many years ago and since then I have realised just how true that saying is. What many don't understand is that Shrewsbury can retain nearly everything that makes it a great place and yet also gain so much more if it just moved on a bit! While we're on the topic of Standing Stillbury, I love Telford's version - Concrete Hardening! :P

Has anyone noticed the huge decline of Shrewsbury in the past century or so? Shrewsbury once had royal patronage to its racecourse, its railway station and railway sheds, depots, etc were one of the great transport nodes of the country, we had important government offices, theatres (okay, we're slowly getting one again), the list goes on. Actually I remember seeing an article in the Shrewsbury Chronicle not long ago which went through many of the things the town has lost.

But wait! Progress = danger! Unknowns! Tut tut... I should have known better...

No I haven't.

Has anyone noticed the huge decline in Britain in the past century or so? Formerly the world's leading economic and military power, it is now largely an overcrowded cesspit with barely any industry to speak of, threadbare public services largely run to provide profits to a small coterie of cronies, and a rapidly widening social gulf between the haves and have-nots. For the more recent decline, I'd blame the evils of Thatcher and Blair and their supporters.

The problems that you mention to do with Shrewsbury (few jobs, no wealth-creating industries, poor opportunities for younger people) are nothing to do with Shrewsbury itself (aside from the fact that it is a bit peripheral to the country's major cities) but are symptomatic of a much wider national problem. I'd suggest that building a few cafes and apartments on a car park in Barker Street isn't going to do much to alleviate it.

And anyway, where are the jobs for ambitious young people anywhere in the country?

No, the majority of towns and cities in England (if not Britain) are very prosperous at the moment - Manchester for example is booming and has changed (and is changing) enormously. The decline of Britain is relative to the rest of the world and isn't too surprising when you consider that we are only a nation of 60 million, compared to much larger nations such as the US (300 million) or China (1,300 million). As we industrialised first we were on top of the game as such, but now everyone else is "catching up".

Your view of Britain is very Shropshire-centric (or more to the point, Shropshire Star-centric).

"And anyway, where are the jobs for ambitious young people anywhere in the country?"

Well they do exist and they're not in Shrewsbury! :rolleyes:

Ah but leaving Rowley's House empty and the car park undeveloped will.

*goes to bash head against wall*

There is brain drain amongst 20somethings but there is also brain gain from 30somethings starting families who want to move back or just want to leave the cities. We really need a uni if we're going to keep 20-30 year olds.

There aren't a huge number of well paid jobs but actual unemployment is very low and Shrewsbury has a comfortably higher average income than most places (including Manchester, Leeds, Birmingham etc) outside London and the SE.

I can't agree with Town Walls pessimism, wages are much higher than ever before and there are plenty of oppurtunities for people, muchmore so than in the past. Remeber that from the 1960s until the 1980s more people left Britain than came here because jobs were so scarce and the country was so depressed, that's certainly not the case now.

It's easy to mock NHS jobs as not 'creating wealth' but why? They pay salaries to local people and provide a much needed service, would it really be any better for the local economy if the Royal Shrewsbury was run by some multinational company? I doubt itit would make much difference personally.

Shrewsbury actually has a lot of small businesses if you look at places like Battlefield or the various business parks, let's not get too gloomy.

I dispute that. Wages for doing exactly the same jobs are higher in places like Manchester and Birmingham than in Shrewsbury. I also remember seeing recently European statistics for English areas, where Shropshire (which I think was grouped in with Staffordshire) was below the EU average and below the levels of Birmingham, Manchester and other cities (though not Liverpool :P ). I'm pretty sure they were wealth figures of some sort (GDP per capita maybe?).

Check out the official HMRC figures

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/stats/income_distri...by-year.htm#314

Go to the table 3.14 for 03-04

Median employment Income of taxpayers in SABC - £16,300

In Manchester - £13,500
In Liverpool - £13,900
In Leeds - £15,800
In Birmingham - £14,800
In Bristol - £16,200
In Sheffield - £14,500
In London - £19,500 (but is that extra £3,200 really going to pay for the extra housing costs?)

While Shrewsbury may not have hugely well paid jobs, people do commute outside the region and we don't have anything like the poverty and run down areas that most big cities have to bring the average down.

For example while Manchester city centre may be booming, but many of the people working there live in Cheshire or Trafford while within Manchester City Council area itself, there are some of the mosst deprived areas in the country.

Thus Manchester gets a higher GDP per capita because that's where the jobs (and therefore the economic output) are based but Cheshire has higher average incomes because that's where the higher paid workers live, I suspect there's a similar relationship between Shropshire and Birmingham/West Midlands

I had no idea about that; I hardly ever look at it. Despite having a local early childhood, I have lived many years around London and Birmingham, so I do try to have a national outlook. Although there are glitzy new apartments, office blocks and the like appearing in some of our city centres, it is a misconception to think that this means that the rest of the country is paved with gold, with lots of high-paying jobs for young people, and that Shrewsbury is somehow missing out. All it means is that someone has got some spare cash to put into construction.

Despite what we are continually told (such as Gordon Brown's laughably patronising comment yesterday that we have not had a recession for ten years), Britain is an economic disaster - we have virtually no manufacturing industry and a shocking trade deficit - about the only thing keeping us going is house-price inflation coupled with the seeming inability of shoppers to keep their credit cards in their wallets. This is relevant because, as I outlined above, Shrewsbury is just as badly affected as anywhere else.

I am sorry to go on like this, as I have no wish to be drawn into a protacted discussion. But I find it hard to believe that any developments which might be proposed for the Barker Street site could possibly create lots of high-paying, long-term jobs. The state of the toilets off Hills Lane mentioned by nickdun is irrelevant; closing them down or employing an attendant is hardly contingent on selling off Rowley's House. Nobody suggested that one way to improve the state of the toilets on Abbey Foregate was to sell off the Abbey. If Rowley's House is left empty and closed for a bit, it may cost a bit of money in maintenance (which would be needed in any case) but the building, and its value, won't be going anywhere. Anyway, I quite like Barker Street as it is. It's nice and open.

"All it means is that someone has got some spare cash to put into construction."

But they wouldn't put their spare cash into new buildings if they were going to remain empty because nobody could afford to live there or there were no firms wanting office space.

I know manufacturing isn't as important as it used to be but that's the same all over the developed world, it's cheaper to do it in China and people want cheaper stuff, it's simple. We still manufacture a surprising amount though, for example, more cars were produced in Britain last year than in any year since 1972.

Manufacturing is only one part of the economy though, services are just as valid a way of creatting wealth.

Our trade deficit isn't ideal but it's less than 3% of GDP which is manageable, look at the US or Spain or Australia, they've all got much worse deficits than we have.

Just look at page two of the Chronicle at how amazing the Rowleys House area could of looked. Let's celebrate the petition, because we now have a unusable building that is falling apart.
I know a lot of people fought very hard, but I think it was totally misguided.

Hurrah for Cardiff! After they built the new Barrage, this place has gone from strength to strength... And now we have Doctor Who and Torchwood too...

Yes, like a pretend 'ye olde worlde' area except we use cars not horses, build with machine made bricks not handmade, use plastic in the expansion gaps not mortar, reconstituted stone for cills and lintols not sandstone,artificial slates (look at the ghastly Pride Hill building). By using modern materials but building quasi- Victorian/Georgian style houses we end up diminishing the real thing ie: Rowleys House. Look at the listed buildings in Julian Friars, soon to be lost in a sea of poor quality pastiche.

Still, the Tudors built for their townsfolk who were then what we today would call of small stature and Shropshire Homes do keep that tradition (have you ever been into any of the Shropshire Homes apartments in Stones Square, Belle Vue, you'd know if you were more than 6' because you would soon develop a stoop! :D

You can't help feeling the fact that Morris Homes used to own Rowleys House and also put in a bid to develop the area must come into it somewhere. <_<

totally know what you mean, but there have been some wonderful developments around town, old eye ear and throat, old brewery etc. St Julian's Friars is unsightly.
But i was geniuinly impressed by the artist impressions in the Chron, thought it would have been perfect and I think we've missed the boat on creating something that people will enjoy and actually use.

The renovation of those buildings has been very good but other than getting into a time machine and returning to 1750s for the brewery and the late Victorian era for the hospital you are not going to get the qualiity or be able to build with the materials of those times. There was plenty of money around before slavery was abolished (although I think some of these American companies we have around run on similar lines today!)
What looked kind of quaint in those sketches (a bit like a German town I thought) would in reality be much the same as Julian Friars and many many other nondescript developments in Shrewsbury.

It would probably not be on the same scale of grossness as say, the new Wimpey development at the old Underdale depot but it would be similar with a small nod at period detail like reconstituted stone stuck in here and there etc.

My father-in-law was a vociferous opposer of this new building at his local church. Ironically his wake was held there in June and out of interest I had found some of the responses during the long protracted planning stages to it on the web. At the wake I spoke to the vicar who said he had even had nails put on his drive as a result of the anger towards the proposed building. He said some parishoners had subsequently admitted it was good and liked it more than they had ever thought they would. (much like some councillors in Shrewsbury regarding the national award winning Mansers) Some churchgoers vowed never to come to church again and some even said the building was unchristian!

I was impressed that the church had risked losing customers in order to build something special and I hope there are many eating humble pie now it is in use even though my husbands father has probably never stopped turning in his grave! :D

The Ark Alvechurch